29 JUNE 2005
Those present: David Hurley (chairman), Jacqueline Bickerstaff, Sandy Hamilton, Peter Mead, Rosy Pugh, Geoff Smith, Jim Whyman (secretary).
Apologies for absence: Andrew Burt, David Davies, Peter Henley, and Matt Vincent.
1. Minutes of the meeting of 27 April 2005The minutes of the meeting of 27 April were signed as accurate.
2. Matters arising not covered below
6.c David Hurley said he had had preliminary discussions with DfT about the implementation of Directive 2003/59/EC on training and qualification for vocational driving licences. It appeared there might be some scope for differential levels of training depending on whether or not the vehicles would be used commercially, although it was difficult to envisage how this might be policed. David said he would draft a paper. DH
3. Fuel Topics
None.
4. UK Legislative Matters
A. Position reports:
a) Review of number plate security measures The analysis of responses to the consultation had shown broad agreement with the measures being proposed, but had not included any reference to the question of being able to obtain replacement plates for 1973-2001 vehicles in the period font. The secretary read a letter from the Association of Chief Police Officers declining to support FBHVC’s request for a change in legislation, and had had to an acknowledgement from Dr Stephen Ladyman, the new minister at DfT, but no substantive reply. JW
[Note: on the day following the meeting, the secretary received a short note from Dr Ladyman saying he had asked officials at DVLA to look into the points being raised.]b) Consultation on proposals to enforce insurance “from the record” No further news.
c) Consultation on improving access to public transport for the disabled David Hurley expanded on his previous report about the proposed changes to the regulations governing provisions that have to be made by service operators for the disabled and commented that there had been a hardening of attitude on the part of civil servants following the initial sympathetic hearing. He wanted to speak to those involved in hiring out older vehicles to canvass their views to enable him to make further representations – he asked those present to provide him with names and contacts details for businesses they knew to be operating in this area. DH
d) Probable extension of the Kent Act nationwide The secretary reported that he had still to receive details of any hardship or inconvenience being caused to anyone as a result of either of the Kent Acts or any similar acts. The only complainant remained Dave True of the National Jumblers Federation whose objections remained generalisations. There had been no new of any consultation from the Home Office.
e) [Omitted from agenda] Consultation on the implementation of the waste framework directive The secretary said he was still awaiting details of the final regulations that were expected to be published during the summer.
f) Consultation on transposing EU Directive 2004/42/CE (on Volatile Organic Compounds) into UK law
The secretary outlined the response that he had submitted. He had urged that UK make use of the derogation allowing the continued sale of “non compliant” products and had offered FBHVC’s assistance in setting up and operating a licensing system to comply with the terms of the directive.
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- 2 -4. UK Legislative Matters (contd)
g) Consultation on amendment to PSV regs to allow vertical exhaust for steam driven buses David Hurley confirmed he had sent a response as discussed at the previous meeting.
h) Driving Standards Agency consultations on test fees and developmental training for qualified motorcyclists
David Hurley reported that he had highlighted in his response the above inflation increases proposed for MoT tests, pointing out the unfairness for owners of older vehicles that could often be tested very much more quickly than their modern counterparts. Jacqueline Bickerstaff commented that she had found nothing to complain of in the consultation on training for motorcyclists, but had misgivings that what was described as a voluntary code might be treated as if it was compulsory.i) MoT Testing of fire appliances David Hurley explained that some “limousine” hire organisations had started to use fire appliances for private hire. There was thus concern that they should be tested accordingly and VOSA had consulted on the subject. David Hurley read his response to the consultation that he had drafted in consultation with the Fire Service Preservation Society and others. The consultation had suggested that appliances should be subject to testing unless owned by local authority fire services. David had supported the principle that vehicles used for hire and reward should be tested but had pointed out that fire appliances did not fit into any current testing category and highlighted the difficulty that would stem from introducing an exemption based on ownership.
B. Consultation on amending compulsory seat belt legislation for children
The secretary said that the long awaited consultation showing how the government proposed to transpose Directive 2003/20/EC into UK law had been published on 13 June. The directive requires introduction of regulations to make it compulsory for children under three to use an appropriate child restraint, and not to travel unless this is available (except in a taxi); to make it compulsory for children aged over 3 and under 150cm tall to use appropriate child restraints where fitted; to ban the use of rear facing seats where air bags are fitted; to require child restraints to comply with specific standards and to limit the number of occupants in vehicles that have seat belts only to those seats for which seat belts are available. Implementation for most items has to be by May 2006, but the final items may be left to 2009. Closing date for the consultation was 5 September.
There was a brief discussion on the implications and it was agreed that the secretary and chairman should both study the detail and report at the August meeting. DH; JWC. Other Matters
a) Road pricing It was agreed that this topic should be on the agenda for next main committee meeting with a view to establishing a Federation policy on the subject. JWb) Consultation of amending notice requirements in respect of crushing abandoned cars in Wales The secretary said he had received a consultation on proposals to bring regulations on the notice that has to be given prior to final disposal of vehicles abandoned in Wales into line with current English regulations. It was agreed that the secretary should respond to the effect that there were no objections. JW
5. Parliamentary Historic Vehicle Club
Geoff Smith said he had asked for a date for a liaison meeting, but had not yet had a reply. GS
6. European Report
It was noted that the amendment to the Road Safety tables by Ari Vatanen and noted in issue 3/3005 of the Newsletter had been approved on what was believed to be a near unanimous basis.
It had not proved possible to get agreement on the proposed driving licence directive, and this was not likely to be re-considered in the Autumn. It was noted that the derogation under which holders of normal car licences are able to drive preserved commercial vehicles would carry forward to the new directive, and would be available for other countries to take up if they wished.
7. DVLA
Sandy Hamilton said that he had requested a routine liaison meeting with DVLA in August and was awaiting a response. There were no major issues, although errors in the issue of the new V5Cs continued to come to light.
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The computerised MoT system appeared to be causing delays and other problems with the system apparently not recognising certain vehicles, leaving testers in a quandary. The secretary said he was awaiting a reply to a recently sent e-mail to a contact at VOSA asking for clarification on certain points and also asking if someone from VOSA could attend the post AGM conference to talk about MoT testing of older vehicles. It was agreed the subject should be re-visited at the August meeting, perhaps with Sandy Hamilton’s MoT tester acquaintance from Bristol in attendance to answer queries. JW
9. July/August Newsletter
No discussion, other than to confirm that the deadline was 13 July and that contents would be as usual.
……………………………………………… Chairman Jim Whyman, Secretary.